Maurice Breuning: I'm writing a persuasive speech on why hydrogen would make a good alternative energy source, but I'm stuck. I'm not sure how to say how hydrogen is efficent. any ideas ? this is the first sentence of it : Another myth is that hydrogen will be inefficient. Hydrogen is, in fact, very efficient.
Maria Bengston: The answer is ... it depends. If the electricity is produced by fossil fuels, the answer is NO. If the electricity is generated by solar, wind, nuclear, etc. it YES.
Anibal Katayama: There are flaws in your theory. First off there is no standard gas tank. Every car has a different shape and size tank. They are designed in a way that it fits into the best space available in a car. Second thing is that the batteries are all connected in series to get a higher voltage. Just like in a flash light. If you take out just one battery it doesn't work at all. But that doesn't mean that you idea is total wrong. The idea that you could have uniform! shaped battery modules that could be quickly changed has merit. That way you could pull into a power station and swap out the dead batteries for charged ones. The only problem with that plan is who is going to pay to build the infrastructure to do it? It gets into the chicken and egg argument. Which comes first. No one is going to pay to build the infrastructure if there are no cars to use it. And no body is going to build or buy the cars if there is no infrastructure to support it....Show more
Ronnie Sardi: this could eliminate a lot of problems such as battery disposal, technology advancement. car range limitations, recharging delays on long trips, and carrying around more battery than you need. Right now any car on the street in the US has a universal gas tank that can be filled at any gas station so why not have a battery bay that can be filled at any Battery station with any brand or type of battery. All batterys would be of uniform size and shape and would not! be owend by the car owner but would leased out to them, so as! technology changes the manufacturer could rebuild them with the upgraded parts,also when you battery stops taking a full charge you just trade it out for a new one. Right now I hear talk of automakers trying to sell cars with a 250 mile range or a on board generator, if you had a battery bay and you only drive 20 miles most days then just carry enough cells to do that and plug it in for recharging each night, and if you decide to go on a long trip, go to the battery store and fill up your bay with all the cells it can carry, and when you have driven far enough to run down those batterys just pull over at a battery station and change them out insted of recharging and be on you way. Maybe we can learn something from the powertool, notebook, and cell phone industry we have all seen how fast batterys are changing and I believe most of us have thrown away batterys that are full of toxic materials a time or two, and these are small compaired to what we will be hauling around in ! our cars ! Just imagine the environmental mess from a car that is supposed to help the environment....Show more
Jacinta Moitoso: I know that it's not that efficient, but I'm supposed to persuade people that it is!
Frederick Mccoach: Sorry, hydrogen is very inefficient because the input of energy needed to get pure hydrogen from H2O is far greater than the output when hydrogen is burned.
Doreatha Kjellsen: Electric motors are far more efficient motive force than infernal combustion because of basic laws of physics.So even if the electric comes from fossil fuel, it needs much less than a petrol car.consider generators use unrefined fuel close to source, so no tankers, pipelines, filling stations, refineries ... all very "dirty" compared to a very efficient national grid. batteriy vehicles could improve the grid efficiency further by storing "off-peak" from renewables (the wind still blows at night) and selling it back at peak periods.Power plants are continu! sly monitored & maintained for optimum load and temperature and emmisio! n levels; most car journies the engine never gets warm enough, never in optimum gear etcAn electric car generates maximum torque from 0rpm so low transmission losses, regenerates electric slowing down, no energy used when stationary. Modern Li-ion batteries, are easy to manufacture & recycle; (unlike an infernal combustion engine complex alloys, transmission clutch, oil ...& catalyctic exaust , or the particulates & Nox, Co2 etc) lifetime is getting to be near that of the car >10 years, recharge in 10 minutes, no gassing ...http://www.altairnano.com/markets.htmlAlso evs are just more enjoyable, fun and pleasent to drive http://www.teslamotors.com , than the clunky, noisy, high maintenance, smelly things the big car makers foist on us with multi-million $ ad campaigns & lobbying to stop aternatives. http://www.whokilledtheelectriccar.com...Show more
Kirk Coolbeth: Patents.
Sol Allphin: Bad news. H2 isn't a fuel source. It's an energy transfer method, and not a g! ood one for transportation. But for the sake of argument, you could focus on the chemical reaction itself, and the use of fuel cells. Just don't mention storage or infrastructure.
Sol Bayn: hydrogen COULD be efficient if it is extracted through electrolysis of water in a clean renewable matter, such as geothermal, solar, or wind. (Like in Iceland and Denmark)But then again it still wouldn't be as efficient as just using the electricity produced to power an electric car.One way hydrogen can be efficient is to use algae to produce it organically....Show more
Florencio Dingle: First off, stop listening to Fox News.Like everyone else has said, hybrid batteries are recyclable. It is also illegal to put hybrid or regular car batteries into a city dump so that really should be a non-issue.
Emery Blando: Fantastic idea. I'm not sure the post about standardizing something still in development is as big a deal as he makes it seem. Your talking about standardizing ! the shape, physical size and terminals of the battery cells, not the ba! ttery chemistry. Take the AA battery size for example. When I was little they were all carbon zinc, then Alkalines took over, NiCads were popular for a while then Nickel metal hydrides and lithium batteries. but the shape and size is still the same. I like the idea of not hauling enough batteries to go 250 miles when I only need to go 20 and I would also feel more comfortable buying an electric car if I knew my car wouldn't be junk went the batteries were worn out. I have several cordless drills that are junk because the batteries no longer hold a charge. I suppose if some new battery technology worked best with a particular shape that might be an issue but historically that hasn't been the case....Show more
Kara Tabian: I answered the safety question in the other section. But as to whether we really want to use hydrogen as a fuel source - it is a misleading way to look at it. Hydrogen is not going to be a fuel source - it is going to be a fuel intermediary. W! e will have to use a lot of energy to product the hydrogen that is loaded into cars. There might be some gain in energy there, I am not sure on that, but it won't be great. What hydrogen does, however, is to move the original fuel use to a central electrical plant where efficiency can be maximized and emmisions captured. Alternative, non-hydrocarbon energy sources such as wind, water, geothermal, nuclear, can also be used to generate electricity - even carbon fuels such as coal. The electricity is used to produce the hydrogen which then burns much more cleanly and efficiently than any hydrocarbon fuel could in a portable motorized vehicle. So, it can convert any energy source into portable fuel and centralize the use of primary energy sources in the most non-polluting way....Show more
Janean Guz: Maybe u can get an idea herehttp://www.physorg.com/news98556080.html
Lucien Hellerman: with that thinking we would be using 8 track tapes and beta for vcrs...as soon as! you mandate a thing all inovation slows,,,batterys arent ready yet,,,m! uch,,,much,,,MUCH more work is needed
Demetrius Coaster: It is simply wrong to try and make the ICE vehicle the standard by which the EV should be measured. They are different vehicles and not understanding that would lead someone to the error of comparing gas tanks to batteries. A gas tank is a container that is relatively cheap to make while a battery is not. Size standardization does not reduce competition on chemistry or energy density. Standardization of what might be called the form factor (size and shape) would allow a manufacturer to use A123 batteries if they were cheaper and more powerful or they could use Maxwell batteries. It would only require a purchase order and not a contract with specifications. A battery manufacturer could make batteries knowing that the same form factor would be used in any number of vehicles or eventually stationary applications. Designers would know what is available and plan for accordingly. The form factor need only be! a component size. In the same way that you can have a flashlight that takes 1AA or 2AA or even 4,6 or 8 you could assemble batteries from the smaller units.Typically such standardization is initiated by industry discussion and then gets a government stamp of approval and requirement. The net result is a great deal of cost savings and this would be in an area that needs standardization. This is the procedure that has given us the plug standard that was later approved with a UL designation.Along the same lines the BMS (battery management system) should be required to be removable and accessible. Should the battery chemistry change. An EV upgraded to a new battery chemistry is likely going to require a new or modified BMS....Show more
Roselee Mczeal:
Corrina Faro: Any replace gas technologies that will improve the generating requirement above modern replace and growth production isn't environmentally friendly. It takes a good number of capability and compone! nts to make a sparkling motor vehicle, much greater for an electric pow! ered motor vehicle using fact the conventional public does no longer settle for a "Batteries no longer coated" coverage. The batteries could additionally might desire to be recycled each 2 years which is composed of much greater capability and a few extra components. All of this represents a large carbon footprint. additionally, the place is the electrical powered energy from, maximum electrical energy in the present day are the two from coal or organic gas. A gas motor vehicle engaged on Fischer Tropsch guy made gas made by potential of bio-mass gasification could be carbon unfavourable while an electric powered motor vehicle charged on coal produced electrical energy could be carbon valuable for this reason if so, the gas motor vehicle could be greater environmentally friendly. the main environmentally friendly selection gas selection could artwork with modern automobiles and distribution networks as a manner to steer away from the environmental expenses of adjusting the ! motor vehicle fleet and of making new infrastructure. this boundaries the alternatives to bio-butanol, bio-diesel, and guy made fuels. of course, motor vehicle manufacturers choose the electrical powered, hybrid and hydrogen routes as they get to make and sell greater automobiles. the conventional public will in all probability circulate with the environmentally risky electric powered, hybrid and hydrogen innovations using lack of understanding and merchandising efforts even nonetheless the technologies to offer biomass derived guy made fuels have been around for the greater appropriate area of a century and has been shown on scales as large as finished countries (WWII Germany, and embargoed South Africa)....Show more
Rona Espalin: The batteries may be recyclable but thats gonna cost an arm and a leg too. most batteries only last a couple years. 6 maybe 7 years tops.
Toney Flaten: Batteries have a recycling system in place already to capture the heavy metals . ! Lead acid batteries used to have some vapor emissions but the new gel p! acks do not have that problem. The other thing to remember is that when the batteries are no longer giving you the range you'd like in your electric vehicle you can still use them in your house to store the electricity from your photovoltaic panels. You would have solar panels if you had an EV wouldn't you? Free power paid for by the savings in gas in a few years....Show more
Arnoldo Budzynski: i dont think so, because most only have a range of maybe 100 miles, so youre going to have to own 2 cars if you go distances and cant use pub transit, and it takes tons of energy to mine and mold the metal and other parts in that second car. plus most of our electricity comes from coal.
Branden Roddick: If your community gets it's power from nuclear or renewable sources then yes they are if your community gets power from a coal plant you aren't reducing anything.
Arnette Dominici: The energy that it takes to make water hydrogen out of water is very inefficient. It m! ay take 10 times the electricity to produce hydrogen as to how much power U could generate.
Son Ahlers: The batteries are not the real problem. Batteries are recycled. They do give off Hydrogen gas when charged, but is not a problem as long as area is well ventilated and no sparks near battery.The main problem with electric cars is they can't make long trips, and because you are charging them with electrical power most of the pollution is just moved to the location of the power plant. Most power plants are coal, oil, or gas. This is good for the cities but from a global warming perspective it doesn't help....Show more
Star Gollnick: There's all kinds of ways to make alkenes (you do mean unsaturated, straight or branched chain hydrocarbons, don't you?), but if you're talking about fuel, you want an economical process. A cat cracking process in an oil refinery is a cheap and effective way to break down heavy hydrocarbons into fractions suitable for motor gasoline! , which include both alkenes and alkanes.A diesel fuel substitute can b! e made from vegetable oil by high pressure catalytic hydrogenation, but it is quite a bit more expensive than petroleum diesel and has not received much attention.DK...Show more
Julee Lanham: The best batteries, of today, only work well in well defined temperature parameters. This is the crux of the problem; How do you get these batteries to perform correctly in sub-freezing to sahara dessert temperature swings, day in and day out? Think about it-the modern truck is designed to traverse all these extremes in a single day AND do it all again day after day, month after month and year after year! A true 4-season electric vehicle, that can perform this well, is the dilemma of even the most adept engineer! Are you willing to migrate to a functionally correct temperate area, just to drive an electric car?...Show more
Marvella Benward: Hydrogen has more combustion power than gasoline. A cars own alternator could produce what electricity is needed to produce hydrogen. ! And the exhaust left from the burning of hydrogen is water, that can run right back to the main water(fuel) tank. Can you imagine never having to fuel your car. A photovoltaic could be a back up carging system. The whole cars' skin could be made of that flexible PV stuff, seen on eco-tech on the science channel on direct tv. More and more things not thought possible before, is starting to happen all over the world. Everything has to do with how things are being done. Everything is possible....Show more
Adan Alipio: Yes.They don't emit "bad vapors" when being recharged.And the batteries can be recycled. Toyota has been doing that with Prius batteries for years. They are designed to be recycled.David J is right tthough. Electric cars will only be truly beneficial when we have alternative energy power plants....Show more
Vida Miss: 1
Troy Monsivais: Not here, they aren't.Electric vehicles run on electricity rather than fossil fuels. In many areas of the! world, electricity is generated by hydro or other more innocuous sourc! es. In Alberta, we use dirty coal to generate electricity. That is, coal with a huge sulphur content, releasing H2S into our environment. We have one of the highest asthma rates in the world. Now, we also have access to abundant underground and biogas methane sources, being one of the world's oil producers, as well as cattle ranching. If we used that to fuel our electricity, electric cars might make sense. Even though our winters are some of the worst of all the world's cities, and they are most unreliable in serious cold. Therefore, our solution currently would be better for diesel or natural gas or some such, eliminating the need for octane for cars and the problem of winter running, rather than switching to electric...Always consider the local source of electricity. Some areas use nuclear, for heaven's sake. Building more of those plants is most certainly not a better choice than gasoline to fuel vehicles......Show more
Jana Sakasegawa: Here's a great page! about Hydrogen fueled vehicles:http://www.greenstudentu.com/Hydrogen.aspx
Rayford Latz: Yes, they are. The batteries are fully recycleable, for starters. The following quote is about hybrid batteries, but the same applies to electric vehicle batteries:"Toyota has a comprehensive battery recycling program in place and has been recycling nickel-metal hydride batteries since the RAV4 Electric Vehicle was introduced in 1998. Every part of the battery, from the precious metals to the plastic, plates, steel case and the wiring, is recycled. To ensure that batteries come back to Toyota, each battery has a phone number on it to call for recycling information and dealers are paid a $200 "bounty" for each battery."http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/technology...Electric cars are refueled (batteries recharged) from the power grid, which does create greenhouse gas emissions. However, because the efficiency of these power plants and electric engines is much greater than t! he efficiency of burning gas, you still get a large overall reduction i! n greenhouse gas emissions. The greener the power grid (more renewables like solar, wind, water power), the lower the emissions created to refuel an electric vehicle.ICE = gasoline car (internal combustion engine)HEV = hybrid gas-electric car (uses gasoline to recharge batteries)EV = electric vehicle (plugs in to recharge batteries)"EVs reduce CO2 by 11%-100% compared with ICEs and by 24%-54% compared with HEVs, and significantly reduce all other greenhouse gas emissions, using the U.S. grid mix. If all U.S. cars were EVs, we’d reduce global warming emissions. Using electricity strictly from coal, EVs still would reduce CO2 by 0%-59% compared with ICEs (one analysis found 0% change; six others found reductions of 17%-59%) and might produce 30%-49% more CO2 than HEVs (based on only two analyses). On the other hand, if electricity comes from solar or wind power, EVs eliminate all emissions. Using natural gas to make electricity, emissions fall in between those from coal a! nd renewable power."http://www.pluginamerica.com/images/EmissionsSumma......Show more
Ulrike Hert: Batteries present one issue, but also think about where we get the energy to charge the batteries. Our electrical power is largely generated from coal and it is filthy, so using electricity to power cars will require more coal consumption and probably natural gas.Or we could conceivably each have solar cells installed at out homes to charge our cars -- except our cars are at the office during sunlight hours, so we would have to store the solar energy to charge our car batteries in another array of batteries at home....Show more
Lawanna Livsey: Maybe you should read some ( if not all) of these books. Our Future Is Hydrogen! : Energy, Environment and Economy by Robert Siblerud, T. Nejat VezirogluTomorrow's Energy : Hydrogen, Fuel Cells, and the Prospects for a Cleaner Planet by Peter Hoffmann, Tom Harkin, Tom Harkin (Foreword by) Hydrogen by David M. HaugenFuel from! Water : Energy Independence with Hydrogen by Michael A. PeaveyThe Hydr! ogen Economy : The Creation of the Worldwide Energy Web and the Redistribution of Power on Earth by Jeremy RifkinThe Hydrogen Age by Geoffrey Holland, James J. ProvenzanoHydrogen : Hot Stuff, Cool Science: Discover the Future of Energy by Rex A. EwingAdvances in Hydrogen Energy by Catherine E. Padro, Catherine E. Gregoire Padro (Editor) , Francis Lau (Editor) Alternative Fuels : The Future of Hydrogen by Michael Hordeski, Michael F. HordeskiFuel Cells, Engines and Hydrogen : An Exergy Approach by Frederick J. BarclayFuel Cells, Engines and Hydrogen : An Exergy Approach by Frederick J. BarclayHydrogen and Fuel Cells : A Comprehensive Guide by Rebecca L. BusbyPathways to a Hydrogen Future by Thomas E. Drennen, Jennifer E. RosthalHydrogen - Hot Stuff Cool Science : Journey to a World of Hydrogen Energy and Fuel Cells at the Wasserstoff FarmOr go to Hydrogennow.org. http://www.hydrogennow.org/You can also mention how Iceland plans to be the first Hydrogen economy, with all of t! heir private automobiles, fishing boats, and public transportation running on hydrogen fuel, Iceland began opening stations in 2003. Also talk about how Since the turn of the millennium, filling stations offering hydrogen have been opening worldwide. Germany & Japan have many Hydrogen Stations, and that British Columbia, Canada is building a seven node hydrogen refueling station network from Victoria to Whistler timed to coincide with the 2010 Winter Olympic Games. Hynor, Norway's first hydrogen fueling station was opened in February, 2007, and. the UK has opened its first hydrogen filling station at the University of Birmingham. Stations in California opened by the California Fuel Cell Partnership, and under Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger's California Hydrogen Highway program. In 2000, Ford and Air Products opened the first hydrogen station in North America in Dearborn, MI. Proton Energy Systems and Northern Power, both wholly owned subsidiaries of Distributed Energy Sys! tems, were contracted by EVermont to build an advanced demonstration hy! drogen fueling station in Burlington, VT. The project was partially funded through the U.S. Department of Energy’s Hydrogen Program. You can then go into how It is estimated that more than a thousand hydrogen-powered vehicles were produced in Germany before the end of the World War II, or that major car companies such as DaimlerChrysler and General Motors Corp, are investing in the more efficient hydrogen fuel cells instead.Ford Motor Company is investing in both fuel cell and hydrogen internal combustion engine research. BMW â€" The BMW Hydrogen 7 is powered by a dual-fuel Internal Combustion Engine and with an Auxiliary power based on UTC Power fuel cell technology. The BMW H2R speed record car is also powered by an ICE. Both models use Liquid Hydrogen as fuel. Daimler AG â€" F-Cell, a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle based on the Mercedes-Benz A-Class. Fiat - Panda hydrogen, a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle utilizing Nuvera's Andromeda fuel cell stack Ford Motor Company â€" F! ocus FCV, a hydrogen fuel cell modification of the Ford Focus, and E-350 buses, which began being leased in late 2006. General Motors â€" multiple models of fuel cell vehicles including the Hy-wire and the HydroGen3 Honda â€" currently experimenting with a variety of alternative fuels and fuel cells with experimental vehicles based on the Honda EV Plus, most notable the Honda FCX, powered by a front-mounted 80 kW AC electric motor, with 20 kW pancake motors providing supplemental power to the rear wheels. Electrical energy is provided by a 100 kW hydrogen fuel cell, with regenerative braking energy stored in ultracapacitors. The first production version of the FCX, dubbed the FCX Clarity, was announced at the 2007 Greater Los Angeles Auto Show. The vehicle is expected to be available in limited numbers for lease only in the Los Angeles area. mid-2008. In November 2007, Honda announced its new Home Energy Station IV that uses steam reforming of natural gas to derive hydrogen! from both the steam and natural gas in equal parts. The Home Energy St! ation IV is 75-percent smaller than older units and provides hydrogen for a car as well as heat and electricity for the home. Hyundai â€" Tucson FCEV, based on UTC Power fuel cell technology Mazda - RX-8, with a dual-fuel (hydrogen or gasoline) rotary-engine Mazda - Mazda Premacy Hydrogen RE Hybrid, with a dual-fuel (hydrogen or gasoline) rotary-engine Nissan â€" X-TRAIL FCV, based on UTC Power fuel cell technology. Morgan Motor Company â€" LIFEcar, a performance-oriented hydrogen fuel cell vehicle with the aid of several other British companies Toyota â€" The Toyota Highlander FCHV and FCHV-BUS are currently under development and in active testing. In November 2007, ten new hydrogen powered Prius cars were delivered to three companies in Iceland by VISTORKA, a shareholder in Icelandic New Energy.Volkswagen also has hydrogen fuel cell cars in development. Mazda leased two dual-fuel RX-8s to commercial customers in Japan in early 2006, becoming the first manufacturer to put ! a hydrogen vehicle in customer hands. BMW also plans to release its first publicly available hydrogen vehicle in 2008, as does Honda. You can bring up that any Internal Combustion Engine (ICE) can be modified to run on Liquid Hydrogen. How about the fact that Hydrogen is what sends the Space Shuttle into Orbit. The following companies modify automobiles to run on hydrogen:AFVTechHydrogen Vehicle SystemsIntergalactic HydrogenThe Hydrogen Car CompanyQuantum Technologies converts new Toyota Priuses to run on hydrogen. Other Uses of Hydrogen Hydrogen is used extensively today to make ammonia, methanol, gasoline, heating oil, and rocket fuel. It is also used to make fertilizers, glass, refined metals, vitamins, cosmetics, semiconductor circuits, soaps, lubricants, cleaners, and even margarine and peanut butter. Hydrogen can fuel today’s internal combustion engine vehicles. Hydrogen can fuel tomorrow’s fuel-cell vehicles. Hydrogen can replace today’s natural gas for heatin! g and cooling homes and powering hot water heaters. Existing wind and h! ydroelectric plants can produce hydrogen to store energy during off-peak hours. Hydrogen production from hydrocarbons can also produce carbon, which, made into carbon fiber, has ten times the strength of steel. With more research, this carbon could be used for automobile bodies and structural members. Sources of HydrogenHydrogen is now made from natural gas (methane), petroleum, coal, various chemical reactions, and from biomass (landfill waste, wastewater sludge, and livestock waste). It can also be made from water by electrolysis. Hydrogen can be made from renewable resources, such as wind or solar. Hydrogen is currently made primarily from natural gas (methane), which is non-renewable. Methane is a recycled fuel (and therefore renewable) when made by anaerobic digestion of biomass. Hydrogen production from hydrocarbons can also produce carbon, which in some forms has ten times the strength of steel. With some research this carbon could be used for automobile bodies and s! tructural members. With this you should be able to convince anyone....Show more
Nicolas Cooley: Both of the points you raised are not valid. Modern batteries--e.g. the ones used in laptops, cellphones, etc--do not emit vapors, toxic or otherwise. The batteries for an electric car are simply larger versions. And disposal of old batteries isn't a real problem--in fact, since they would normally be switched out at a service station, its almost certain they would be sent to processing facilities. So there'd be LESS impact on the environment than alll the batteries people use now and mostly just throw in the trash--where they end up in landfills.There is one legitimate problem with electrics--not with the cars themselves, but with the source of power. Although electrics are environmentally clean, much of the gain we make by using them is lost because we still rely heavily on coal powerplants to produce the electricity in the first place. So--in addition to pusing for! alternatives like electric cars, we also need to push for alternatives! to coal/oil as a source for electric power. Fortunately, with the current breakthroughs in solar power (which is lowering prices to competitive levels) and nuclear (where progress is dealing witht he safety issues) we have the means to shift away from coal-based power....Show more
Providencia Serpe: Perhaps next time they could assign you to make a persuasive speech about why two plus two equals five. That's about the same sort of argument you've been asked to make. You don't have the engineering background to make any pertinent points, nor should you be expected to. Debate is for matters of law, ethics, religion, and politics. It's not for technical matters that are properly be proven in the laboratory or by mathematics. You can read this to whoever thought up this silly exercise....Show more
Ervin Laeger: I've read that driving a Hummer is actually better for the environment than driving a Prius. This is because batteries are extremely toxic and becaus! e Prius batteries are made in Canada and therefor must be shipped to Japan to be installed. When all is said and done, the environment actually is worse off. If you want to reduce emissions drive a clean diesel and more importantly DRIVE LESS!
